bug in firmware regarding washer fluid level - IMMO3?

[Worfje]

Dear autopilot (and others),

I might have found a bug in the firmware for B5.5 with IMMO3 concerning the detection of too low washer fluid level. On my test setup it is not detected by ColorMFA. When I swap the cluster in the setup, with another original cluster, the too low washer fluid level error is given and shown.

ColorMFA firmware version: v2.9.4_b24
Cluster: 3B0 920 829 A (v07)
Cluster coding: 05115 (thus, wash fluid warning is enabled)

I verified the voltage on pin TrInput8 (LED - low wash) in regard to ground.
When pin 6 of T32b (green connector, low wash) is floating (= not connected to ground): 0.7 V.
When grounding pin 6 of T32b, to simulate 'wash level ok', I measure 10.4 V.

Comparing the voltages with the brake pad warning (which is correctly detected) on TrInput2:
When pin 7 of T32b (replace brake pads warning) is floating: 0.7 V.
When grounding pin 7 of T32b, I measure 10.4 V.

I am fairly sure the cluster is ok, since when disconnecting pin 6 from ground, the cluster gives the (loud) beep that you expect when getting the low washer level warning. Only the ColorMFA firmware is not responding to it...

On all immo3 cluster Low Washer level goes from CAN-bus. No need external connection.
Cluster must be right coded.

I have checked the electronic schematics in ElsaWin for my car (Passat 3BG, AVF/HCN from 2005), but the wash fluid level sensor is only connected to pin 6 of T32b on the cluster and not connected to CAN-bus:

Please feel free to give me instructions in how to debug this!

[Worfje]

I just checked in debug mode that the wash fluid warning is enabled within ColorMFA firmware.

[Worfje]

Below screenshot with pin 6 of T32b floating (which is connected to TrInput 8 and giving status 'on', which is correct/expected):

Below screenshot with pin 6 of T32b connected to ground (which is connected to TrInput 8 and giving status 'off', which is correct/expected):

For me this confirms that for my car type (and possibly others) there is a bug in the firmware.

[autopilot]

Where you test it ? On the table or in car ?
It may not work on the table, because CAN-bus may not active.

but the wash fluid level sensor is only connected to pin 6 of T32b on the cluster and not connected to CAN-bus

Not need direct connection from sensor to CAN-bus. Sensor connected to dashboard, dashboard send info to CAN.

I'm tested some dashboards for B5 and washer level work correctly on all of them without additional connection (TrInput8).

[Worfje]

Where you test it ? On the table or in car ?

I test it on the table using a ignition coil, cluster & ECU including ODB connection.
Motor-CAN is connected between cluser & ECU. Comfort-CAN is not connected.

It may not work on the table, because CAN-bus may not active.

Motor-CAN is active, thus the wash fluid level information must be available on Comfort-CAN.
Is there an easy way to activate Comfort-CAN? Or do I need to connect the comfort module?

On the Passat 3BG (aka B5.5), the cluster connects with ODB using k-line.
The cluster connects with Motor-CAN and w-line to ECU.

Not need direct connection from sensor to CAN-bus. Sensor connected to dashboard, dashboard send info to CAN.

Ok, I understand your explanation.

I'm tested some dashboards for B5 and washer level work correctly on all of them without additional connection (TrInput8).

So, for Passat 3BG we could skip soldering this wire to TrInput8...

[autopilot]

Is there an easy way to activate Comfort-CAN? Or do I need to connect the comfort module?

Connect any ComfortCAN device to dashboard (except other dashboard). CCM, door module, audio/navi...
You may see activity in ColorMFA ->menu->System->CAN-monitor.

So, for Passat 3BG we could skip soldering this wire to TrInput8...

In Excel file in manual it say about TrInput8 "only for immo2".

[Worfje]

Ok, I just bought a CCM on ebay.

In the excel file of the English manual I downloaded it only states 'Do not connet anywhere' in case of FIS type cluster (and since I have MFA type cluster...). I think it would be good to add this info at earlier pages in the manual.

Good to know it is not a bug, but a design choice by you.
I will let you know if connecting the CCM solves the issue of having no warning for wash fluid level.

[autopilot]

Install it to car. Is the best check than any other.

[Worfje]

I agree, but still learning on how to adapt the cluster to car, want to upload a cool startup logo and awaiting info on which output pins I can solder to unused pins of T32b or T32a to allow the cornering fog light feature and also want to test the TPMS module 8E0907273.

[autopilot]

but still learning on how to adapt the cluster to car

Just clone immo/keys from you original cluster with DashDumpEdit: https://www.drive2.ru/l/471768829593126099/
After clone and install to car need change coding of 17 and 19 ECUs via VCDS/VAG-COM. Coding must changed in car, not on the table.
It's easy. And after that you may use two dashboard in your car without any changes/adaptation.

[Worfje]

Is there an advantage to clone immo/keys using DashDumpEdit in regard to adapting the donor cluster using VCDS (needs SKC/login)?

[autopilot]

This is only your choice.
In my opinion cloning is faster (read-modify-write) and do not need to have all the keys at the time of adapting (Some use the key in the remote engine start system and the key is hidden in the car).
Also possible use two dashboard without any changes. Just remove one and put the other. No need adapting again.

[Worfje]

Thanks for your clear answer and I totally agree with your answer after trying it out.

The cloned tacho was accepted without any hesitation, the mileage was copied and the key didn't need to be adapted.
Great program (DashDumpEdit)!

[Worfje]

I was able to activate the comfort-can by connecting a comfort-module.
I wanted to activate the comfort-can so I could test the activation of the washer fluid level warning.

With the comfort-module connected, the washer fluid level warning was indeed given.
Strange thing that I saw is that comfort-can remains active on tacho, even after disconnecting the comfort-module and power cycling. It is not important to understand this, but I was interested if you know why the tacho keeps the comfort-can active only having a connected comfort-module once.

[autopilot]

I did not specifically check bus activity immediately after turning off other modules in CAN-bus.
But different dashboard (different firmware of dahboard) work not equally. Some dashboard not send info to CAN if other devices (activity from other devices) not present, some dashboard do not check activity and always send typical values to bus...
In your case I can not say anything definite.

[julius]

Не стал плодить новую тему, спрошу здесь. Сразу же после установки цветного первым делом проверил реакцию на низкий уровень в бачке омывателя. Приборка (immo3 Passat B5.5), как и положено, выдавала соответствующее сообщение, которое после доливки омывайки пропадало. Однако, спустя какое-то время, сообщение вновь появилось, когда бачок был полным. Чистка датчика ничего не дала. Через пару дней стал заниматься реализацией функции опускания правого зеркала, для чего естественно разбирал зеленую фишку. После того, как все собрал и подключил, сообщение пропало. На всякий случай довёл уровень омывайки до минимума, о чем приборка успешно сообщила, снова долил - сообщение пропало. Но спустя пару дней назойливая ошибка опять загорелась и не гаснет по сей день. Пробовал опять разбирать фишку и шевелить в ней контакты, особенно 6-ой, который, как я понимаю, шёл к лампе омывайки на старом экране. Результат нулевой. Подскажите, куда копать? Возможно ли проверить, приходит ли сигнал на контакт фишки? Должна ли загораться лампочка при отсутствии контакта между 6-ым пином фишки и приборкой? Конечно же нельзя исключать неисправность датчика уровня в бачке, но все-таки в совпадения мне слабо верится, а датчик до этого ни разу не подводил.

[autopilot]

К сожалению толком ничего подсказать не могу.
Цветной на иммо3 не подключается ни к датчику, ни к лампочке. Все данные на КАНе. Т.е. как-то повлиять на работу датчика и штатную схему в приборке он не может.
Проверить проводку к датчику, сам датчик... Можно проверить целостность провода возле разъема приборки и внутри. Бывает, что переламываются провода именно недалеко от разъема или внутри него (обжим пина). Снятие/установка приборки как раз "шевелит" проводку и на какое-то время контакт может появится. Даже не знаю что можно еще сделать.

[sg1]

I have Passat B5, immo 2 and once (far before i install colormfa) troubleshoot washfluid indication. I found if i short connect contacts in connector which goes to washerfluid reservoir, lamp goes off, when they are open lamp goes on.

If so it means all instalation and tidy are ok and problem was sensor itself, or contact between connector and sensor.
Hope this can help.

I also have once problem with lamp for brakepads wear indication - it was false positive too. Principle of operation is the same - lamp goes on when circuit is somewhere broken. In my case connector near the front right wheel was oxidated, when i cleaned it error disapeared.

[julius]

If so it means all instalation and tidy are ok and problem was sensor itself, or contact between connector and sensor.
Hope this can help.

Thanks for advice, but the problem was different.

Можно проверить целостность провода возле разъема приборки и внутри. Бывает, что переламываются провода именно недалеко от разъема или внутри него (обжим пина). Снятие/установка приборки как раз "шевелит" проводку и на какое-то время контакт может появится.

Достал из 6-го разъема зеленого шлейфа проводок и немного поджал контакт обжима пина - все пришло в норму

[autopilot]

Достал из 6-го разъема зеленого шлейфа проводок и немного поджал контакт обжима пина - все пришло в норму